Moto Guzzi Loop Frames - Body, tank, fenders, side covers, tool boxes, fairings, saddlebags

Decals

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Tank, fender tip, and side cover decals can be hard to find. And, if you do stumble across some 30 year old "new" decals, they're liable to be next to impossible to actually use. Fortunately, John Prusnek has created brand new, high-quality decals that are very close to being exactly like the original silk screened version. I used them during my Ambassador restoration and I am very pleased with them. You can get all the information you need from John at his website.

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Fairing (the stock or Polizia one)

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I really like the look of my Ambassador without a fairing. But, sitting upright while riding 80 MPH down the highway is much more enjoyable when you aren't pushing 80 MPH wind with your body.

My Dad suggested that I use a stock fairing (which was designed using the now famous wind tunnel at Mandello del Lario), rather than go with an after market version. He mentioned that former MGNOC Illinois Rep Bob Ferris thought that it was the best protecting fairing he had ever ridden behind. Fortunately, my Dad had a stock fairing and some of the necessary parts in his stash in Texas.

So Dad shipped me the parts he had and I ordered a windshield (MG# 12577250) and two V braces (MG# 12578621) from MG Cycle. This left me with a few parts I needed to find or make myself.

I made patterns of several of the parts that can be fabricated in the common home shop.

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Here is what I did for the remaining parts...

Major components

• Fairing (MG# 12575421): My Dad sent me this. Alternatively, you may be able to purchase a replica from MG Cycle. Take note that there are two versions of the fairing: one for V7 / V700 models and one for Ambassador and Eldorado models. The difference in the two fairing has to do with the length of the 'nose' of the fairing AND with how far back the undersides protrude. The V7 / V700 fairing is longer in order to accommodate the longer headlight shell. A long-nose fairing will definitely fit with a shorter headlight shell (there aren't any differences in the fork ears), but you will have a most difficult (impossible) time trying to keep your headlight adjusted properly. Furthermore, the underside of the V7 / V700 fairing protrudes further back than the later fairing...so much so that it will contact the later tank when the handlebars are turned fully right or left.
• Windshield (MG# 12577250): I purchased one from MG Cycle.
• Aluminum trim piece (MG# 12578240): My Dad sent me this. Download the pattern above using the "fairing_parts.pdf" link if you would like to create one yourself.
• "V" bracket (MG# 12578621): I purchased two from MG Cycle. Download the pattern above using the "fairing_parts.pdf" link if you would like to create these yourself.
• "U" bracket (MG# 12575540): My Dad sent me two of these. Download the pattern above using the "fairing_parts.pdf" link if you would like to create these yourself.
• Gasket [fairing to headlight] (MG# 12578940): My Dad sent me this. Alternatively, you may be able to find a very soft 1/4" or 3/8" diameter rubber tube, slice it open length-wise, and wrap the tube around the headlight opening in the fairing. Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle reports that McMaster-Carr item number 12335A52 works very well in this application.

Windshield to fairing connections

• Gasket [fairing to windshield] (MG# 12577940): For this I used an old length of motorcycle inner tube. The natural curve in the inner tube approximates the curve of the windshield. I punched the needed holes with a gasket punch.
• Bolt (MG# 98260520): I substituted stainless steel 3/16" x 24 x 1" tapered head bolts. The heads fit very nicely into the aluminum trim piece (MG# 12578240).
• Flat washer (MG# 95000205): I substituted stainless steel 3/16" flat fender washers. I think the larger diameter of the fender washers will help even the pressure on the fiberglass fairing.
• Nut (MG# 95602205): I substituted stainless steel 3/16" x 24 nylon insert lock nuts.
• "U" clamp (MG# 12578450): My Dad sent me two of these. One "U" clamp should go around the windshield and fairing on each side of the windshield. Download the pattern if you would like to create these yourself.

Fairing to headlight connections

• Bolt (MG# 98054318): I used 6 mm x 1 mm x 18 mm bolts.
• Flat washer (MG# 95021106): I used 6 mm flat washers.
• Distance tube (MG# 91180707): Neither my Dad nor I had one of these to evaluate. Not knowing the dimensions, I ordered four of them from a dealer (two for him and two for me). When I got them, I realized there is nothing special about them at all. Each is a 7.5 mm long tube that has an outside diameter of 10 mm and an inside diameter of 7 mm. A 6 mm bolt (MG# 98054318) fits through the tube and into the special bolt (MG# 12740740). The fairing itself is then free to rotate on the distance tube (MG# 91180707).
• Special bolt (MG# 12740740): Although you may be able to find this special bolt, I chose to make the two I needed from a 1/2" stainless steel bolt. This took quite a bit of work on the grinder, and some slow going with the tap and die (stainless steel is much more difficult to work with). In the end, my bolts are as good as the originals. Download the pattern if you would like to create these yourself.

Faring to "U" bracket connections

• Bolt (MG# 98260625): I substituted stainless steel 1/4" x 20 x 1" tapered head bolts. The heads fit very nicely into the finish / trim washers.
• Finish / trim washer (MG# 12577840): I substituted stainless steel 1/4" finish / trim washers.
• Small rubber washer (MG# 45212400): I created my own using 1/8" thick neoprene washers I found in the plumbing section of my local hardware store. I used my gasket punch set to size the washers properly. The outside diameter is 5/8" and the inside diameter is 5/16". The real purpose of this washer is to prevent the finish / trim washer (MG# 12577840) from cutting through the large rubber washer (MG# 93110060).
• Large rubber washer (MG# 93110060): I created my own using a 3/32" sheet of neoprene I found in the plumbing section of my local hardware store. The outside diameter is 7/8" and the inside diameter is 1/4".
• Flat washer (MG# 95021106): I substituted stainless steel 1/4" flat washers.
• Nut (MG# 92602206): I substituted stainless steel 1/4" x 20 nylon insert lock nuts.

"U" bracket to "V" bracket connections

• Bolt (MG# 98054316): I used 6 mm x 1 mm x 16 mm bolts.
• Washer (MG# 95021106): I used 6 mm flat washers.
• Nut (MG# 92602406): I used 6 mm x 1 mm nylon insert lock nuts.

"V" bracket to handlebar connections

• Bolt (MG# 98054318): I used 6 mm x 1 mm x 18 mm bolts.
• Lock washer (MG# 95021106): I used 6 mm lock washers.
• Flat washer: I also chose to use 6 mm flat washers between the lock washers and the "V" brackets.

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Fuel tank repair

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The fuel tank on my Ambassador was showing signs of rust on the inside. So, prior to having it painted, I used a several stage system designed to (1) remove gum, sludge, and varnish, (2) remove rust and prepare the tank for the sealer, (3) seal the tank against any further damage. The kit worked great and I've had no problems. The kit even came with a patch for repairing holes or weak areas, but I did not use it and cannot attest to it's ability. I purchased the entire kit from a company called POR-15. They call it a "cycle fuel tank repair kit".

Alternative

Thanks to Ken Giese for providing the following information on the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

I picked up a gallon of horticultural molasses at a feed store. The 850T has a "collar" inside the fill hole which REALLY limits access and sight angles. Top to bottom filling really appealed to me considering the top of the tank was probably where the bulk of the rust was. I forgot to mention that I rinsed the tank out first with soap and water to loosen things up. I also shook some bb's around. A real hassle getting them out as the filler hole collar leaves drainage to the petcock holes. Plugged up those holes and filled 'er up.

Nothing happened for a few days (molasses is a long process) but about the 3rd day I noticed the solution was draining out the top onto the floor. Topped it back up and even more on the floor the next day. Then it started "burping" every once in awhile. Obviously some sort of chemical reaction. I decided to put the cap back on and shake it up in case of settling. Wow. When I opened the cap it exploded out like a shook up cola bottle. What a mess, so a word to the wise. All said I let it set for about 10 days, drained it and rinsed with water. Bare metal. I was impressed!

After it dried, I sloshed around some phosphoric acid to prevent rusting until I add gasoline. Figure I can treat the tank again in a few years if desired rather than add a sealer.

Update:

My yearlong, slow restoration project is nearly complete; meaning that blasted tank sat with nothing in it and rusted again! Not bad, but more than flash rust. The phosphoric acid treatment only lasts so long by itself. So, this time I sealed it with POR-15 after researching the product and corresponding with their service dept. I again got the rust out with molasses. I didn't buy their kit, just the sealer. Terrific product. Yes, if the bike was ready to ride I could have just filled it with gas and been done with it as originally intended. Interestingly, POR-15 thought I'd be ok "naked" with a full tank of gas. But with the next step of painting and a planned Oct launch I like knowing it's sealed.

Alternative

Thanks to Greg Barratt for providing the following information on the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.:

Milkstone remover is sold in gallons and is very reasonably priced - about USD $7.00. Use about 1/3 gallon, and then fill the tank with water to the very top. Let it sit for a day or so (in the sun helps a little), empty it, rinse it, and dry it with a heat gun and a little alcohol. The phosphate leaves a coating to inhibit rust. The solution also can be re-used. Just filter the crud out, and bottle it up.

You can get milkstone remover at Tractor Supply Company. Dairy farmers use it to clean their milking equipment.

Alternative

Thanks to Kevin Hahn for providing the following information on the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

I can get a gallon of phosphoric acid for about $7 at the local farm store. Its labeled as pipeline cleaner or milkstone remover.

Works good as a rust remover but don't get it anywhere near aluminum. That includes the petcock. It will eat that away in a couple of days. For badly rusted tanks I will fill it with a mix of the acid and water and let it sit. Sometimes I will put some nuts and bolts or a length of chain it it to knock some of the stuff loose. Everytime I walk by it I'll give it a shake.

Alternative

Thanks to Greg Field for providing the following information on the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

Milkstone remover for dairy bulk tanks. Available at Fleet Farm-type stores. Or OSPHO, available at good hardwares.

Alternative

Thanks to ??? McMillen for providing the following information on the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

I have a bottle of some stuff called "The Works" - says it removes rust from bathrooms - has phosphoric acid and other stuff it says... after treating the interior of a tank with it one would want to "stop" the acid with baking soda solution washdown...then maybe a half ounce of marvel mystery oil in the tank before every fill up.

Alternative

Thanks to Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle for providing the following information on the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

Charlie followed the instructions presented at Ken French's Electrolysis Setup. Here are a few notes and several photos...

• You want Arm & Hammer "Super Washing Soda" which is normally found at the supermarket in the aisle with the laundry detergent. Comes in a yellow box. Here's where I found the procedure in the first place: http://650rider.com/Content/pid=6.html I bought two large (5 gallon?) plastic buckets to mix the solution in and to drain it back into when done. Used a large plastic cup to transfer the solution from the bucket to the tank.
• I've had no reoccurance of rust so far, but it is winter (low humidity) and I do keep the tank full as much as possible.
• The rubber plugs were purchased at the local Ace Hardware, any good hardware store should have them. I've seen them in the hardware section of the local Lowe's. You want the black rubber not cork ones. The small ones are 3/8" at the smaller end, 9/16" at the larger end. The big one is 1.5" at the smaller end and 1.75" at the larger end. I used a 3/32" drill bit to make the holes in it for the sacrificial anode.

Sacrificial anode.Sacrificial anode.

Placed into the tank. Tank filled with a solution of Arm & Hammer Washing Soda water.Placed into the tank. Tank filled with a solution of Arm & Hammer Washing Soda water.

Electricity supplied by battery charger. 12 volts, 6 amps.Electricity supplied by battery charger. 12 volts, 6 amps.

Anode after 8 hours.Anode after 8 hours.

Final cleaning of the tank. Drained the solution, then flushed thoroughly with the pressure washer.Final cleaning of the tank. Drained the solution, then flushed thoroughly with the pressure washer.

Clean metal. Two large bottles of rubbing alcohol are next, sloshed around to disperse any remaining water.Clean metal. Two large bottles of rubbing alcohol are next, sloshed around to disperse any remaining water.

Drying the tank. Drained the alcohol, then used the heat gun on low to dry the insides.Drying the tank. Drained the alcohol, then used the heat gun on low to dry the insides.

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Gas cap gasket dimensions

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Civilian flip-top gas cap

60 mm OD x 39 mm ID x 3 mm Thick (1/8" thick material works well)

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Gas cap replacement

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I had the police style cap on my Ambassador (just a round cap, no lever). Although my gasket was good, I kept getting leaks through the venting mechanism. I kept hoping to be able to get a NOS or good used one off of ebay, but no luck.

John Ulrich told me that he replaced his with one from Dennis Kirk. Finally sick and tired of cleaning up leaked fuel, I purchased the vented cap from Dennis Kirk (Dennis Kirk part number: H18199; Drag Specialties part number: DS-390130).

It looks very close to original, fits well, and seals perfectly. When changing out my petcocks with a tank nearly full of fuel, I set the tank on end for over 10 minutes without any leaks from the cap.

Update: Now that I've used the cap for a while, I've discovered that it let's air in fine, but does not allow air to escape. This may not seem like a problem, but too much pressure inside the tank will stop the fuel flow (I'm not sure how this happens, but it does). This usually isn't a problem unless you are running long distances at speed. Pressure will build up inside the tank to some point, and then the engine will faulter. Open the cap to allow the excess pressure to escape, and the fuel flow continues and away you go. This seems to happen more to me on hot days than on cool days. John Ulrich drilled a couple of strategically placed holes on the underside of his cap to prevent this from happening. I did the same, but then the cap started leaking again (I like to fill my tank up very full). So, I'm back to the drawing board. Until I find a better solution, I will continue to use the cap from Dennis Kirk.

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Keys for tool boxes and fork lock

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I extracted this information from Fred Sahms off of the old Topica Loopframe_Guzzi news group (which has now moved to Yahoo!) AND from Duane Ausherman's website AND from the MGNOC publication "Tips for Guzzis, Volume II."

The locks for the tool boxes and fork lock were made by Neiman (German company). I've not tried these key blank cross-references, but I believe them to be correct.

• Neiman
• Taylor B69K
• Ilco V06

If you have an original Neiman key, a copy, or a key code, you can cut your own blanks. Here is how to decipher the code from a key.

• Each number in the code represents the depth of the cut that is to be made. 5 is no cut at all. 0 is the deepest cut. The first number represents the cut nearest to the portion of the key that is held by the hand. Not all keys have 6 digits.
• So, using the first key shown below, we have:
  • 1 - a deep cut almost to the slot
  • 2 - not quite as deep as a 1
  • 4 - a very tiny cut
  • 2 - equal to the previous "2"
  • 5 - no cut at all
  • 0 - a deep cut clear to the slot; this one happens to be at the end of the key

Key code = 124250Key code = 124250

Key code = 351140Key code = 351140

Key code = 153340 Key code = 153340

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Paint codes

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These paint codes were derived from numerous sources.

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Painting

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I've used each of the companies listed below and I've been happy with the results and the prices charged for the services rendered.

Minneapolis, Minnesota area

Rob Reardon
(952) 292-8886

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Paint removal - before you blast...

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Be extremely cautious before you use any type of impact blasting process to remove paint from sheet metal. All of those tiny bits are acting like miniature hammers and can/will change the shape of your sheet metal. This can have especially negative consequences on the radius of fenders...particularly the rear fender - making it very difficult to install it again within the frame. How do I know this?

Instead, I recommend a less chancy approach such as baking the old paint off. This requires special ovens that heat things up to 800 degrees Farenheit or so...and the paint just burns off. Or, you could simply use paint striper and/or good old fashioned sandpaper to remove the old paint.

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Petcock alternative

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Based on recommendations from Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle and Greg Field, I decided to swap out my existing stock petcocks for petcocks from a small block Guzzi and adapters to work on the loop tanks.

I had a number of reasons for doing this...(1) tired of trying to get my petcocks lined up properly with shimming washers (2) tired of not having a real reserve (3) tired of worn out internals seals - although the latest set of viton seals from Bruce Giller have worked very well.

The small block petcocks are nice units. They have three settings on both petcocks: Off/On/Reserve. They are mirrored right to left so it is easier to remember which way to turn the petcocks to make them function how you want them to. Operation is smooth.

The adapters are machined stainless and are of high quality. The threads that mate with the tank are quite long for a good fit. Instead of a fiber washer, I used a 12 mm aluminum crush washer to seal the adapter to the tank. Nice stuff.

The petcocks come with small filter screens that screw into each petcock. When secured to the adapters, the filter screens no longer fit. Using a tip from Greg Field, I cut off the plastic bottom of each screen close to the screen material and then JB Welded the screen to the top of the adapters.

I purchased the adapters and petcocks from Moto International. I believe the adapters are a MI exclusive.

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Petcock repair

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My petcocks started leaking / weeping and rather than replacing them, I decided to attempt a repair. The leaking / weeping problem is usually not the washer between the tank and the petcock - which is an easy fix anyway. Rather, the leak is usually caused by a worn out rubber gasket inside the petcock.

There was a tip in the MGNOC newsletter submitted by Bruce Giller suggesting that 1/16" and 3/32" thick Viton be used as a replacement material. Viton is expensive and I couldn't easily find any locally. So I decided to try Neoprene.

The aluminum Orlandi petcocks use 3/32" material. I found a 7 3/4" diameter disc of 3/32" thick Neoprene at my local Ace hardware store (enough for lot's and lot's of petcocks). It was in the plumbing section...I have no idea what it is normally used for.

The chrome plated brass petcocks use 1/16" material. I found a very large 1/16" thick Neoprene washer in the plumbing section of my local Menards home improvement store Danco Company, Stock Number 61808B, UPC Code 0 37155 61808 8). The washer is 1 1/2" in diameter and has a 3/16" hole in the center. The remaining material leaves sufficient room to create 3 gaskets..

I stuck the Neoprene in a can of gas for about 24 hours and didn't see any deterioration; none of the material came off when I rubbed it vigorously with my thumb. So, I figure that it is pretty safe to use, although I'm certain Viton would be better.

Making the gasket and repairing the petcock is not difficult, just follow these steps:

1. Remove the tank from the bike.
2. Remove the petcock from the tank.
3. Place the petcock in a vice so that the front (where the handle is located) is sticking straight up. I used two pieces of wood to sandwich the petcock so as to avoid damage.
4. Unscrew the handle. I was able to use a pliers to grip it firmly. This technique left only very small marks on the handle for me. It is possible to disassemble the petcock without removing the handle, but reassembly can be more difficult as the spring-loaded bolt will be cockeyed.
5. Using a wrench or a socket, unscrew the bolt from the face of the petcock. There is a spring under there, so be careful not to let things fly across the garage.
6. You should now see the rubber gasket. I used a small pick to remove it. You will notice that each hole in the body of the petcock (one hole connects to the fuel tank, one hole connects to the fuel line) has a very small pipe that extends partway through the two corresponding holes in the rubber gasket. This construction prevents the rubber gasket from turning, thus alleviating any need for an adhesive to hold the rubber gasket in place.
7. With the gasket removed, you can now make and install the replacement. I used a hollow punch set to create my holes. I purchased the set from a tool tent sale a number of years ago. Harbor Freight sells a similar 9 piece set.
   • Aluminum Orlandi petcocks: Use the 3/32" material. For the outer diameter, I used a 3/4" hole punch. For the two holes inside the gasket, I used a 3/16" or a 7/32" hole punch.
   • Chrome plated brass petcocks: Use the 1/16" material. For the outer diameter, I used a 5/8" hole punch. For the two holes inside the gasket, I used a 3/16" hole punch.
8. Assembly is pretty much the reverse of disassembly, except for the following tips:
   • I made sure that the surfaces that come into contact with the rubber gasket were free from nick, burrs, etc.
   • I put grease on all the parts before reassembly. Some of it will definitely wash off, but hopefully some will remain to help lubricate things.
   • Getting the bolt started into the face of the petcock can be challenging because the spring is working against you. I used a box-end wrench for the bolt and pressed down with a small deep-well socket on the bolt itself. I found this method very effective.
   • I used a little bit of loctite on the handles. I've heard that they have a tendency to rattle loose and fall off if they are not secured well.
9. Before mounting the tank back on the bike, I installed each petcock and tested for leaks with the handle turned in all directions, both with fuel flowing freely from the fuel line and with the fuel line plugged to provide a little back pressure.

So far, my repair seems to be working out well (repair made March 10, 2004). If the status changes, I'll post that information here.

Follow-up: My petcocks started leaking again only a few short months after I replaced the gaskets with neoprene. I contacted Bruce Giller and he sold me several of his viton gaskets. They installed very well and are working great. They also have a better "feel" than the neoprene. Contact Bruce Giller to get your own set.

If you have the chrome plated brass petcocks, contact John Chicoine for the proper seals.

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Pin striping tape

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When pin striping my tank, tool boxes, and fenders, I wasn't sure what size or brand of tape to use. After speaking with my painter, Rob Reardon, I ended up going with the product he recommended and we both decided on sizes together after looking at numerous photos. Here is what I used:

3M Scotchcal Striping Tape (available through most auto supply stores, although they'll probably have to order it).

• For the tool boxes: 72456 (1/2" x 150' Bright White). The tape is 1/2" wide but contains two stripes: 1 stripe that is 1/4" wide and 1 stripe that is 1/8" wide. The two stripes are separated by a 1/8" space.
  • 3M's product info
  • 3M Id: 75-3466-9018-5
  • GTIN(UPC/EAN): 0 00 51141 72456 0
  • Buyer's Part Number: 72456
• For the fenders: 73256 (4/16" x 150' Bright White). The tape is 1/4" wide but contains two stripes: 1 stripe that is 1/8" wide and 1 stripe that is 1/16" wide. The two stripes are separated by a 1/16" space. 3M's product info.
  • 3M's product info
  • 3M Id: 75-3467-5738-0
  • GTIN(UPC/EAN): 0 00 51141 73256 5
  • Buyer's Part Number: 73256
• For the tank: 73256 (Same as for the fenders). Except that we separated the 1/8" and 1/16" pieces to use them for different areas of the tank.
  • 3M's product info
  • 3M Id: 75-3467-5738-0
  • GTIN(UPC/EAN): 0 00 51141 73256 5
  • Buyer's Part Number: 73256

In sum, we used most of the 73256 roll and just a little bit of the 72456 roll.

Since I don't plan to change the pin striping, we applied the pin striping to the base coat and then applied the clear coat on top.

Free

If you would like some of the 72456 roll (see image below), just let me know. I'll send you four, nine inch lengths (enough for one mistake on each toolbox) in a first class envelope. If you can get some use out of it and don't need to buy an entire roll for yourself, just send me an email message.

This is an enlarged scan of the 72456 pin striping tapeThis is an enlarged scan of the 72456 pin striping tape

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Pin striping the tank - chrome panel

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First off, the original shape of the chrome panel was NOT the same across all tanks. Not only are there large differences between the early V7/V700 tank and the later Ambassador and Eldorado tanks (plus plenty over overlap between), but there are minor differences between any two tanks that came off the production line next to each other and even differences between the left and right sides of an individual tank (not a mirror image). So, there is no rosetta stone that will give you the single exact shape that came from the factory.

Mark Etheridge of Moto Guzzi Classics sells a matched pair of magnetic shapes (his favorite shape chosen from many) so that all you need to do is position them, mark the outline, and remove.

John Prusnek sent me the shape he used on his tank. Notes from John:

A method I've used is to mask off the chrome panel and scuff up the tank chrome with 400 or 600 wet and dry, being careful around your panel mask.

When you're done with this, take a 1/4" wide striping tape and lay it half over the mask and half over the scuffed up tank and paint the tank. What you're doing here is creating a 1/8" scuffed edge around the chrome panel for your striping paint to get a bite into. Use 'One Shot' sign painter's paint for striping.

When you peel everything off you should be left with a shiny chrome panel with a 1/8" sanded chrome ring around it, which is covered half and half with the 1/4" pinstripe that laps the chrome and the paint.

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Pin striping the tank - top rectangle

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When pin striping the top rectangle on my Eldorado project, I created this template based on information from John Prusnek and John Ulrich (see below).

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I gleaned this information from John Prusnek off of the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

• The width of the front is 6-1/2"
• The width at back is 5-1/8"
• The length of a side is 14-7/8"
• The length down the middle is 16-1/4"

Dimensions are of the outside of the actual inner 3/8" pinstripe rectangle . Outside of this is a 1/16" space then the 1/16" pinstripe. What you would want to do is lay down your 1/16' striping tape on the outside of these measurements and put your thick line on the inside and the thin line on the outside if you're doing it by hand.

I measured this on a bike that's been repainted and striped, but it's pretty close to original. I've got some pics of it here, with some additional pinstriping photos that may be helpful.

In one pic I have an original tank with a ruler on it, hard to read, get close to the screen.

I wouldn't get too anal about the sizing, I'm sure that they're all off a little bit, since the pinstriping was applied by hand, and most likely freehand at that. On the examples I have the top and bottom line is curved to follow the tank rather than square. On the 2 Ambos I've rebuilt the chrome knee panels were different shapes on each side of the tank, by as much as 1/4".

I gleaned this information from John Ulrich off of the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

If I lay a piece of paper over the edges of the top vertical stripes the inside stripe is 3/4" higher.

Lower arc is 1/4" lower then the two vertical stripes

I took the alignment measurements from the gas cap opening (screw off)

• 3.25" forward to the bottom of the first stripe (wider one on mine)
• 10.25" south to the lower stripe edge
• 1.75" east/west from the edge of the opening

All measurements are to the first edge of the wide (inner stripe)

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Plating (Zinc)

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Exchange service

Moto Guzzi Classics
1831 Redondo Avenue
Signal Hill, CA. 90804
(562) 986-0070

Plating companies

Aetna Plating Co
6511 Morgan Ave
Cleveland, OH
(216) 341-9111
(800) 584-8055

Automated Finishing Technologies
1498 N. Bolton
Jacksonville, TX. 75766
(903) 589-7377
Note: Recent reports from customers indicate this company no longer provides top-notch zinc plating services. BUYER BEWARE!

Full Service Zinc
3200 West 121st Street
Cleveland, OH. 44111
(216) 641-8200
(866) 265-9262
Note: Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle reports good results with this company.

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Powder coating

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I've used each of the companies listed below and I've been happy with the results and the prices charged for the services rendered.

Minneapolis, Minnesota area

Powder Coating Technologies
14920 28th Avenue North
Plymouth, MN. 55447
(763) 559-4779

Phoenix, Arizona area

Arizona Powder Coat
5301 East Washington Street
Phoenix, AZ. 85034
(602) 220-0553

Wichita, Kansas area

Lorac Company
624 East Harry Street
Wichita, KS. 67211
(316) 263-2565

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Powder coating - what to do, what not to do

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Opinions vary widely on this issue. At the end of the day, do whatever you want. But, here is my advice:

Powder coating is a wonderful process. It is very durable and lasts a long time. Powder coat is good for the following things:

• Frames
• Swing arms
• Side and center stands
• Top and bottom triple tree plates
• Fork lowers
• Battery trays
• Battery hold down brackets
• Battery hold down bolts
• Front foot pegs
• Frame to rear brake drum stays
• Seat pans

There is a definite draw back to powder coating (beside the fact that you pretty much have to bake it or blast it off). I would NOT choose to do it on any of the sheet metal because it shows tiny scratches very easily. I'm not talking about scratches that go to the metal, but very light surface scuffs that come from washing, waxing, etc. I would go with regular paint for the sheet metal because you can always polish out those tiny scratches. My only exceptions to this rule are the seat pan and the battery tray. These pieces are rarely visible and highly susceptible to rust...so I choose to powder coat them.

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Rear fender installation

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When I disassembled my Ambassador, the rear fender came apart just fine (at least as far as I can remember - things always seem to come apart better than they go back together). But when it came time to put the rear fender back into the frame, I couldn't believe how tight it was. I just couldn't get the bolt holes to line up. Perhaps the bead/sand blasting that was done to it before painting had created a slightly larger arc. Or, maybe the fender was that tight from the get go. At any rate, it was tight enough for me to stand back and take a look at my frame to see if it was bent. It wasn't.

I ended up calling John Schwartz for some advice. He assured me that my problem was not uncommon. He had encountered very stubborn rear fenders on loop frames before, too. The long and the short of it is that getting the rear fender mounted back into the bike can be difficult. Using some of John's advice and some of my own ideas, I eventually got the fender mounted and in place. Here is what worked for me:

• Before doing anything, I protected all possible touch points that I didn't want scratched with old bath towels.
• I started by loosely connecting the fasteners at the top rear of the fender.
• Next, I loosely connected the fasteners that run through the toolbox, the battery tray, and fender.
• Then, using pry bars and slow but steady determination; I eased the battery tray into place and secured it.
• At this point, I had lot's of fasteners loosely connected. So, tightening in small increments, I moved from one to another until all were tight.

This all sounds nice and systematic...but, as you can well imagine, it wasn't. Good luck.

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Saddlebag - Dan Brown (DB) bag hinges, latches, and trim

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I extracted this information from John Ulrich off of the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi newsgroup.

For replacing the factory metal trim strip, I used a chrome body side molding from Custom Auto Trim and Graphics kit# MDGWW-TP (5/8" Trapezoid Wheel Well Molding). It runs $39.00 for a 20 ft roll. It does use 3M adhesive so once it's stuck on, it's for good.

Mike Harper of Harper's Moto Guzzi put me on to Ohio Travel Bag who supplies Hardware Elf the original hinges and latches for the DB Saddlebags. The M-016A hinge sells for $0.99 each and the L-018 chrome latch with #2133 key sells for $7.49. Shipping is $7.98.

M-016A hinge for Dan Brown (DB) saddlebagsM-016A hinge for Dan Brown (DB) saddlebags

L-018 chrome latch with #2133 key for Dan Brown (DB) saddlebagsL-018 chrome latch with #2133 key for Dan Brown (DB) saddlebags

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Saddlebag - Dan Brown (DB) bag lights

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Style 1

I extracted this information from Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle off of the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group. In Charlie's own words:

Truck-Lite part number 99041R (red) or 99041Y (amber) *should* be what you need if I remember correctly. Measure yours to be sure.

Truke-Lite Part Number 99041Y

Style 2

Thanks to Charles Hamer from sending me this information in a private communication.

For certain versions of the DB saddle bags, like the one on my Eldo, one bag comes with 2 red lights which lenses where made by Dietz (very hard to find). You can get the exact same one and really the exact same one, (except of Dietz it says Signal-Stat).

Truck-Lite part number 9093 (red) (picture is amber only)

Napa part number 6802189

Truke-Lite Part Number 9093

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Saddlebag - Joseph Buegeleisen Company of Detroit (Buco) bag weatherstrip/gaskets

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I extracted this information from AJ Huff off of the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group. In AJ's own words:

Hi guys, I don't know anything about any other bags other than the Bucos that came with my bike. In rehabbing them (not refinished and NOT restored) I replaced the top weather stripping with some that I bought from McMaster-Carr. I could not get an exact match, the new stuff is a little taller, probably better made. This makes a very tight, almost too tight seal. I'm pretty sure they are water proof from rain.

Here is a side by side comparison, new above, old below.Here is a side by side comparison, new above, old below.

Here is a end-on view, new on the left, old material on the right.Here is a end-on view, new on the left, old material on the right.

Here is a view with the new stuff wrapped on the bag.Here is a view with the new stuff wrapped on the bag.

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Saddlebags

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My Dad brought me a set of Bates saddlebags (including a trunk) from his stash in Texas. But, for some reason or another, I didn't exactly like the way they looked on the bike. I wanted something a little more square. So I racked my brain for something I could use. I really didn't want to use soft-sided luggage and finding a set of Moto Guzzi lunch pale bags was going to result in less than instant gratification. What to do?

Moto Guzzi lunch pale bagsMoto Guzzi lunch pale bags

In what I thought was a stroke of great genius and originality, I decided to use US Army Surplus ammo boxes. Only after I made this decision did I realize that others have had the same idea and have used the exact same boxes. So much for my genius and originality! At least I'm in good company.

US Army Surplus ammo boxes as saddlebagsUS Army Surplus ammo boxes as saddlebags

I was able to pick up two 20 mm ammo boxes. These boxes are 8" wide x 14.5" high x 17" long and have a removable lid. The lid has a rubber seal that creates a very tight seal once closed. On either side of the box is a diagonal strip of steel that is spot welded to the ammo box.

In order to mount the bags closer to the bike (I am using the stock saddlebag mounting rack. I removed the diagonal strip from the inside side of each saddlebag. I found a 1/2" drill bit worked well to remove the spot welds. I chose not to remove the strip from the outside side of each bag, because the removal process tends to leave small dents and marks (and paying for body work on ammo boxes seems ridiculous to me).

Stock saddlebag mounting rackStock saddlebag mounting rack

Stock saddlebag mounting rackStock saddlebag mounting rack

Stock saddlebag mounting rackStock saddlebag mounting rack

Stock saddlebag mounting rackStock saddlebag mounting rack

Stock saddlebag mounting rackStock saddlebag mounting rack

Careful tape measure and eyeball alignment by my wife and I, and I was ready to mark and drill the holes. A few nuts and bolts and the saddlebags were firmly secure.

If I had a military machine, I would have left these painted olive drab (or perhaps re-painted them olive-drab). But since my Ambassador is black, I wanted to spruce them up a little to match the rest of the bike. Because I wanted the paint to be very durable and not cost too much, I decided a gloss black powder coat was the way to go. A local company took care of heat striping (they were afraid that sand blasting would deform the metal) and powder coating the boxes and lids.

I am very happy with the results. The bags are certainly heavier than fiberglass or leather bags, but the bike and the rack handle the extra weight just fine (especially since I don't ride two-up very often, especially on touring trips). If you would like to see photos of the finished bags mounted on my Ambassador, check out My Ambassador page.

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Saddlebag - Wixom bag latches

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I extracted this information from Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle off of the old Topica Loopframe_Guzzi news group (which has now moved to Yahoo!).

I've been looking at these latches as replacements on my Wixom bags McMaster-Carr item number 1863A23. They're 2 1/2" long, 1 1/4" wide, protrude 13/32", nickel-plated, and key locking.

McMaster-Carr item number 1863A23

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Saddlebag - Wixom bag lights

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I extracted this information from Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle off of the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group. In Charlie's own words:

The light is really no biggie unless you're a stickler for originality. Peterson Manufacturing has a near perfect replacement for the original: Part number 135. The lens will even fit the original base but doesn't snap on very securely. I've seen the complete light at the local NAPA and Lowes for around USD $3.00.

Peterson Manufacturing Part Number 135A

Peterson Manufacturing Part Number 135R

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Saddlebag - Wixom bag weatherstrip/gaskets

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I extracted this information from John Prusnek and Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle off of the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group.

Charlie Mullendore: McMaster-Carr never fails to amaze me with the variety of stuff they've got! Go to McMaster-Carr and search: "Edge-grip Rubber Seals" and/or "Bulb Seal Weatherstripping". Lots of choices, might try a few myself!

John Prusnek: To seal saddlebags I've used the closed cell foam strips they sell at hardware stores for insulating around doors and windows. It's nice and cushy so they seal tight and don't rattle, and is self adhesive on one side for easy installation.

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Side cover screws

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For some reason or another, side cover screws seem to disappear. You may be able to find a used pair of screws on ebay, but they are getting rare and more expensive. You could also create a functional - and less attractive - set yourself using a long 6 mm bolt and two nuts.

As a very nice looking and affordable alternative, Joe Kenny machines aluminum replacements that look and work great! His website provides all the contact information that you'll need: http://www.swva.net/jkenny. In my opinion, these are better than the originals.

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Tool box lock replacement

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I extracted this information from Greg Barratt off of the old Topica Loopframe_Guzzi news group (which has now moved to Yahoo!).

Use the McMaster-Carr item number 13105A75. It is a much nicer lock, doesn't clip on like that chintzy universal one, has a lock nut, keyed alike, waterproof. It comes with a couple of different latches. I use the straight one, cut it way down. Overall I've used 4 of the universal ones, and now 2 of the 'good ones' - there's no comparison.

McMaster-Carr item number 13105A75

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