Moto Guzzi Loop Frames - Seats

Backrest

• Print this section

Thanks to Doug Peters for providing me with these photos. Thanks Doug!

• Back to top

Rain cover for motorcycle solo seats

• Print this section

Many of today's modern motorcycles come with waterproof seat covers direct from the factory. However, many older or replacement seat covers are stitched or made of non-waterproof material. This becomes quite problematic when rain is encountered. A wet seat can take a long time to dry out and is a most unpleasant perch on which to sit oneself.

In the summer of 2004, my wife Angela and I moved from Eden Prairie, Minnesota to Odessa, Florida. I quickly learned that Florida receives a serious amount of rain; 52 inches annually in Odessa compared to 33 inches annually in Eden Prairie. If I was going to ride whenever I wanted to, I needed to improve my gear. I already had my Aerostich Darien suit and my Oxtar Matrix boots...both perform very well in the rain. However, I discovered that my stitched police solo seat became completely waterlogged, absorbing rain like a sponge. I was essentially sitting in a bowl of water. Not even the Gore-Tex material of my Darien suit could keep my bottom dry. I decided I needed a rain cover.

Homemade solution

When I initially wanted a rain cover for the Moto Guzzi Classics police solo seat on my Ambassador, I couldn't find a ready-made product. So, after much careful thought and planning, I decided that I could make my own rain cover from vinyl and elastic. The next time Angela and I were at the local discount store, I told her I needed to go over to the sewing department. She inquired as to my peculiar desire and I shared with her my brilliant idea.

Instead of the "Oh, Honey, you are so smart and wise (and handsome)!" response I was hoping for, she looked at me skeptically and gently explained that the vinyl might be too thick and the elastic too thin.

She suggested I look for a more flexible material. But, her suggestion fell on deaf ears. I wanted my rain cover to be durable. I chose the heaviest and stiffest vinyl available, flat certain I could make it work.

Back at home I pulled out the sewing machine and then carefully measured and cut the vinyl and elastic. Everything was set and I started to sew the vinyl. Only, it didn't want to move...it would just stick to the surface of the sewing machine and make a bunch of stitches all in the same place. Somehow I forced my way past that problem - breaking only a dozen or so needles in the process - and got a hem sewn into the vinyl.

Now it was time to feed the elastic through the hem I had just sewn. Only the vinyl was so thick and stiff that it took me near forever to get it all the way through.

Finally, through stubborn determination and bull-headed will power, my masterpiece was complete. I had triumphed over adversity and proudly took my precious creation out to the garage. I asked Angela to witness my moment of victory.

It looked terrible. I mean really terrible. "Fit" is not the word to describe how it went on the seat. A big ugly piece of vinyl scrunched up and sort of covering most of the seat, it resembled a shiny black diaper. I sat on it to see if things would improve. No luck. It didn't afford any movement, bunched up in awkward places, and kept me stuck to the seat.

A total failure. There was no way I was going to be using this. I should have listened to my wife. (It'll never happen again, Sweetheart. I promise!)

At this point I resorted to garbage bags until I could find a professionally made rain cover.

Harley Davidson

Harley Davidson was the first company to come to mind as they have produced jillions of solo seat equipped motorcycles over the years.

• Cost: USD $29.95.
• Fit: I purchased part number 51638-97. It fit my police solo seat very well. The elastic had the right amount of stretch and there wasn't an excessive amount of material.
• Waterproof test: I did a quick waterproof test with the rain cover and found it not waterproof at all. The test: I turned the rain cover inside out so as to form a bowl. I filled the rain cover with about a gallon of water from my sink and held it up. Water dripped through immediately. I took a quick look at the Harley Davidson website and discovered that the rain cover is only water resistant, not water proof. Good grief, I didn't think I'd have to verify that before placing an order.
• Real world use: It passes rain water through to the seat and back to my bottom quickly and efficiently. Even indirect spray from the garden hose while washing the bike will dampen the seat underneath the rain cover.
• Durability: Seemed fairly durable, though I'm not sure what for? Perhaps it would hold up well when used as a drip irrigation system in the back yard.
• Final thoughts: The Harley Davidson rain cover is a product that does precisely what its name states: it covers a seat in the rain.
• Website: http://www.harley-davidson.com

Russell Cycle Products

Fed up with the rain cover from Harley Davidson, I ordered a rain cover from Russell Cycle Products (you know, the makers of the "Day-Long" saddles).

• Cost: USD $30.00.
• Fit: Russell initially sent me their smallest size...which ended up being way too big for my police solo seat. After speaking with them about it over the phone, they offered to make me one smaller using measurements that I provided to them. They were very friendly and easy to deal with. The replacement rain cover fit very well. The elastic has the right amount of stretch and there isn't an excessive amount of material.
• Waterproof test: I did a quick waterproof test with the Russell rain cover and while not 100% waterproof, it is very close. The test: I turned the rain cover inside out so as to form a bowl. I filled the rain cover with about a gallon of water from my sink and held it up. No immediate leaks. I left the water sit for about an hour. Upon reexamination, the underside of the cover was damp. This is in stark contrast to the Harley Davidson cover, which when filled with water passed it straight through in droplets.
• Real world use: I used this seat cover during a great many rainy rides in Florida and along the East Coast (especially riding to and from the Virginia rally). All told, I'd guesstimate that I've ridden 3,000 miles of heavy rain using this cover on my seat. It does a pretty good job of keeping the rain out. But with enough rain, the seat eventually becomes damp underneath the rain cover.
• Durability: This rain cover saw a great deal of use when I lived in Florida and held up very well.
• Final thoughts: The Russell rain cover is made of a thick black material. It comes with a stuff sack made of the same material which helps prevent abrasion when it is stored within my metal toolbox. Due to the thickness of the material, it takes up more space than the CoverAlls rain cover (see review below). All in all, a good product.
• Website: http://www.day-long.com

CoverAlls

David Rutledge read my reviews of the Harley Davidson and Russell Cycle Products rain covers on my website (http://www.thisoldtractor.com/gtbender). He owns the company, CoverAlls, and sent me a solo seat rain cover for my Ambassador and asked me to evaluate it. He also sent along a few extra rain covers to give away as door prizes at the 2008 Arizona MGNOC Rally. David was pleasant and easy to work with. I was more than happy to test his product.

• Cost: USD $27.95.
• Fit: I was sent Model CM. It fit my police solo seat very well. The elastic has the right amount of stretch and there isn't an excessive amount of material.
• Waterproof test: I did a quick waterproof test with the CoverAlls rain cover and found it to be 100% waterproof. The test: I turned the rain cover inside out so as to form a bowl. I filled the rain cover with about a gallon of water from my sink and held it up. No immediate leaks. I left the water sit for about an hour. Reexamination revealed zero indication of leaks. Wow! I was impressed.
• Real world use: Now that we live in Cave Creek, Arizona, rainy rides are much more infrequent (13 inches annual rainfall). However, the Friday before Memorial Day weekend (2008) found some pretty good thunderstorms rolling through Cave Creek. Although I wasn't too excited about the prospect, Angela convinced me to go riding in search of a downpour (the first time I'd ever gone looking for a wet ride). I was able to ride through some pretty good rain and fairly deep standing water for 15 minutes before the skies cleared. Back inside the garage, I pulled the rain cover off and found the seat completely dry. It also kept the seat completely dry while I was washing the bike with a garden hose sprayer (with ample water directed at the rain cover). Finally, a rain cover that does what I want it to do.
• Durability: The material is altogether different from that of the Harley Davidson and Russell Cycle Products rain covers. The top side is reflective silver while the underneath is dull blue in color. It is thin and light, but feels sufficiently durable to the task.
• Final thoughts: The silver reflective material should do a good job of reflecting the heat from the summer sun when the bike is parked. It is also very lightweight and comes with a stuff sack made of the same material. It fits in my toolbox with more than ample room to spare. I certainly don't have as many "liquid sunshine" miles on the CoverAlls rain cover as the Russell rain cover I've been using for the past few years, but thus far it has been a great product.
• Website: http://www.coveralls.biz

• Back to top

Review of Mark Etheridge's Police Solo Seat

• Print this section

I promised to write a few words about the Police Solo Seat that I purchased from Mark Etheridge and used on the trip up to the 2005 National MGNOC Rally in New Cumberland, West Virginia...

http://www.motoguzziclassics.com/mgcparts2.asp

• The look - What can I say? I think solo seats accentuate the lines of the loops and look cool. Personally, I like the police solo better than the springer solo seat. It is all personal preferance, of course.
• The price - USD $250.00 may seem like a lot until you start pricing out the cost of having your existing seat redone by some of the big - or even little - names out there (or the price of any little thing that has the BMW name stamped on it :>). I think it is fair and reasonable, this day in age.
• The quality - The pan is made of fiberglass and is very sturdy. It didn't seem to flex at all when I sat on it. Also, the rearmost studs that secure the seat just above the toolboxes are embedded well and did not seem like they would strip out. I certainly didn't torque them down super tight - but my seat isn't going anywhere, either. Paul Linn recommended that I put a couple of rubber washers between the fiberglass and the frame at the rear mounting points...just to keep the glass from wearing on the frame - I'll be doing this. The front-most securing tabs lined up perfectly with the holes in the tube and the securing bolt went right through. The cover comes from the hyde of the endangered Nauga animal (or some other vinyl) and looks very nice to me. It is secured with actual stitches - rather than being embossed onto a preformed piece of naugahyde. This does mean that water can get into the needle holes during the rain. While riding, this was not a problem. After the rains at the rally, some water did get into the foam. It didn't seem like very much, though, and wasn't an issue. I plan to apply some seam sealer and take care of it for good.
• The comfort - I find this seat much more comfortable than my worn-out dual seat. I think two things contribute to this (a) The shape of the pan is wider and more ergonomically correct for the gluteous maximus (b) The foam used is a lot better than the worn-out foam on my old dual seat. When I first got the seat, I road it around for about 50 miles or so and was quite satisfied. On the trip up to the Nats, I straped my gear in such a way that it would provide me with a little back rest behind the seat. I thought that this would be more comfortable. In the end, I found that - for me - it didn't work. The back rest kept me in one position and had a tendency to push me forward on the seat. On the iron butt trip home, I packed everything so that I had plenty of room to move around and no back rest whatsoever. This was the key for me. I never felt myself sliding forward AND I never remember consciously moving around on the saddle much. Paul Linn and I had been thinking about ways to raise the front of the seat...but I don't think I'll need to do that anymore.
• Room for improvement - There is only one area that I would modify with the seat: foam density. Even though I road all the way home on the seat (1,050 miles in 19 hours and 20 minutes and my butt wasn't sore), I think the foam needs to be more dense (stiffer, harder). This is coming from my 230 pound body. Mark is aware of this issue and is struggling to obtain the higher density foams he wants to use.

Finally, as with all things having to do with YOUR backside, your mileage may vary. As for me, I'm quite happy with the police solo seat.

• Back to top

Seat cover adhesive

• Print this section

Thanks to Marvin Mayo and John Prusnek who posted this information on the Yahoo! Loopframe_Guzzi news group in reply to a post from Charlie Mullendore of Antietam Classic Cycle. In Charlie and Marv's and John's own words:

Post from Charlie Mullendore

I'll be recovering the '71 Ambo's seat with the nice cover from Harper's and wondered if anyone had something better than what I've been using in the past to attach it. I've tried regular old contact cement and 3M Weatherstrip Cement and neither does much of a permanent job. The cover always seems to come loose eventually and needs to be stuck back on. Don't want to resort to riveting it on as I've seen done.

Any "magic" stickum that's worked for you?

Reply from Marvin Mayo

About 15 yrs ago I sewed a new cover for may son's V50II & installed it w/ an adhesive. I used lots of clothespins to clamp the cover to the seatpan 'til it dried. I'm almost certain that the adhesive was Pliobond. The adhesive still holds but his dog ate the top of the seat a couple of years ago. IIRC Pliobond's most common usage is in shoemaking & shoe repair. Don't buy a lot of it, 'cause it will set up on you while stored on the shelf.

Ashland Pliobond Adhesive (also available and local harware stores such as Ace)

Reply from John Prusnek

As a hippie I had a leather shop and made lots of sandals, glued them together with 'Barge' contact cement. If you can find a shoe repair shop they should have a tube. The trick is to coat both surfaces, let them dry well, and clamp them together very well and evenly, maybe fixture up a couple of thin metal or wood strips and lots of c-clamps.

You also may consider using some quilt batting between the seat and cover, glued on with spray adhesive, helps to even out the seat if the foam's funky.

I haven't had the pleasure of recovering a Guzzi seat, but some honda seats I've done are made of plastic thick enough to drive short staples into, others had sharp V notches on the inside pointing up, just stretch the cover over and hook it on, which was a simple and elegant way to attach the cover.

Barge All Purpose Cement manufactured by the Quabaug Corporation (also available and local harware stores such as Ace)

• Back to top

Solo seat alternatives

• Print this section

Ural seat alternative

Thanks to Uwe Ziebarth for providing me with this information in a private email.

I have had the same problem three years ago - this original "replicated" Policia Solo seat from Italy w/ the seat pan made of plastics was dissatisfying, not stiff enough. The old one w/ the steel pan was stronger but ditto not rigid enough.

After a long research (also on Harley related sites ; - ) I found a real stiff solo seat on a Ural related site: http://www.russenteile.de/shop/

Sellers description:

"Supersaddle, designed in Germany especially for Dnepr bikes zinc- and powdercoated, strong metal seat with waterproof seatcover, made of strong, waterproof motorcycleseat vinyl (Spare covers available)! This seat is larger and a lot more comfortable than the original russian rubber(pain)saddle. Tested by more than threehundred ironbutt's of the german and american russianbike-community!!"

The Seller also ships to USA and sells on ebay USA.

This is a real "buttometer" seat - stiff and rigid.

The background: if you're driving a rig, it is very important to "feel" what's going on.

If you hit the road on a motorcycle with a sidecar a little fast, there is one important point: In left turns the rear tire starts to slip first and if you keep pushing, the rear tire comes up in the air. Then the sidecar turns over its own wheel and tries to bore the nose into the ground...

To prevent this, it is really important that you "feel" that point in your butt ; - )

To mount this saddle it needs a double U-shaped bracket to be welded and then mounted on the frame (there was a 8 mm inner diameter hole in the frame, behind the tank, which I used for mounting) and the springs from an "original" solo seat.

Or the nice looking hairpin springs from the friendly Harley supplier.

One more benefit is, that you have a length adjustment in a wide range (up to 60 mm, in 4 positions).

I'm very satisfied with this solution and rode even longer trips without any problems. i.e. our last holidays 2000 km in three weeks. Well, we are no "ironbutts" and prefer smaller roads and try to avoid the "Autobahn", therefore our daily trips are around 200/ 300km only.

A bit of a long explanation - but I hope this helps.

Ciao, Uwe

• Back to top