Subject: Loop serial numbers - long
Author: Ian Adkins
Date: Dec 23, 2001, 10:40 AM
Post ID: 1709222046
Yup......I've been keeping tabs on the numbers. I forwarded the spreadsheet
to Dave and Mike. Maybe Dave can post the list to Looplist. And Mike will
put up a map with the locations.
It's pretty neat to see where all the bikes are located. With everyone
giving where they were located last week I was surprised to see one fella
that lived very near where I lived in Fl. I sure wish I would have known
that a few years ago before I moved away :-)
As for what I learned about the numbers:
The only series of Loops that had mismatched frame and engine numbers were
the V700's. Frame numbers for this series ranged from 1xxx to 2xxx. Engine
numbers for all I recorded were higher than the frame numbers but followed
no pattern. What I learned was that they merely took whatever engine was
next on the assembly line and stuck it into the frame that was ready. These
bikes did not have a VIN plate rather the numbers were stamped into the
steering head (and into the engine casing of course). These bikes were
produced 1966-1968 (approx)
There was a point where they upped the engine to 750cc. These bikes are the
"Rare Birds" that are denoted with an "A" in front of a five digit serial
number. Both frame and engine serial numbers matched from now on.
Basically the bike was a V700 with bigger engine and different paint (now
available in black, red, white) and pinstriping. All the "A series" Ambos I
recorded have a serial number 12xxx. Did I mention that this series is the
most valuable of all the Loops :-) Charlie and I both agree that one of
these babies will cost you $25,000 :-) By the way...these bikes did not have
the VIN plate either and were produced late 1968-1969 (approx).
When they went to the full blown Ambo in 1970 they had a VIN plate, frame
and serial numbers matched and the serial numbers were from 13xxx - 26xxx.
This series ran 1970-1972 (approx)
For the Eldos....production started in 1972 and ran till 1974. Serial
numbers on these bikes were from 51xxx-62xxx. Some variants had a "VP" in
front of the numbers. I speculate that this denoted the "versione policia".
Something like that.
It was very common in the "old days" to build a bike in a given year and
title it as a later year. I guess the dealers could sell a previous year's
model as a new bike. This is obviously not allowed today. Funny....but I
have a friend here in Montreal that has a V700 titled as a 1972. He bought
it new!
When they went to the VIN plates they put on it when the bike was built. For
example my 70 Ambo (16865) was built in July 70.
It appears that there was no particular start or stop date for a particular
series. What they did was phase in the new series when the old stock ran
out.
By the way...there are some great resources that I would recommend:
Greg Field's book "Moto Guzzi Big Twins" details the history of the Loops
with lots of great pics. If your wife, kids, or dog is still looking to get
you a Christmas present.....this is a good one. It is an excellent book and
a great addition to the "Guzzi" library.
There is a Buyers Guide out there by Mick Walker. He talks about the marquee
and lets you know what the value of these bikes will be in the future with a
star rating. By the way....the Ambos were listed as the most collectible :-)
I also wrote an article on the Rare Birds. I think it is still on the MGNOC
web site under "articles".
I agree that any Loop on the road is a valuable Loop but the ones that are
kept original with corresponding frame and engine serial numbers will be the
most valuable.
Regards to all......Ian
-----Original Message-----
From: Hunter Jones <rjon-@nc.rr.com>
To: Loopfram-@topica.com <Loopfram-@topica.com>
Date: December 23, 2001 12:40 PM
Subject: RE: 1975 build plate and signing in
Hey Folks, There will be confusion. But fortunately we have Ian to keep up with the serial #s! I am sure he has found a pattern by now. The Guzzis I have owned have been in strict numerical order by build date. I am curious as to when the frame # and the engine # were no longer matching as built. I don't recall any loops but I have seen Tonti frame bikes that came fron the factory with mismatched numbers. That will be a sticky point as those bikes pick up in value. I have always tried to keep the numbers together as down the road it will matter! Check out the old car market. A Pontiac GTO without the right engine in it loses out on value. It will come to that one day for the Guzzi. I already look for matching |
| That's not to say that it is not worth getting the stuff together to get one on the road if the numbers don't match. I'm all for keeping as many on the road as possible as riding them is what it's all about! It will just affect the value at some point. I'm not a sticky beak number checkin' no ridin' bike collector. Mine have oil and gas and a valid plate! I once asked a fellow (as I sat on his V 7 Sport which was roped off from the public and did not smell at all of fuel) "When is a motorcycle not a motorcycle?" Answer:"When it's a piece of furniture." |